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Is Allah The Same God As Christians Worship?
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One Seed, Divided Worlds, Christianity vs Islam – Walter Veith & Martin Smith WUP 240
Hello and welcome to this special episode of What’s Up Prof. Hi Walter. Hi Martin. Are you doing okay? Don’t ask me.
Yes I’m doing fine. We’re running around like headless chickens but today we’ve got a very special guest. Very special guest.
Would you like to introduce him because you’ve been working with him for quite a while. Well I’ve known Shahbaz for quite a long time and I’m very happy to be talking to Shahbaz. He has an amazing testimony.
People should listen to it and he is a wealth of knowledge and he’s very active in his work and reaching out to the Islamic world and it’s a privilege to speak to him. Hi Shahbaz. Welcome Shahbaz.
Hello Walter. Hello Brother Martin. Good to be with you both.
Okay so we have also an interesting backdrop that will be leading into the discussion but I think before we discuss this let’s have a word of prayer to open up our discussion. Yes. Okay.
Heavenly Father we thank you that we can be able to do discussions like these. It’s important but it’s also not that easy. So we ask that you be with us with the Holy Spirit and guide us through this in Jesus name.
Amen. Amen. This is a very controversial subject because there are so many opinions and so many views on this issue and I think it’s a good time to put some things on the table to see exactly where we stand on this issue and is it relevant for the time in which we are living.
So thank you gentlemen for having me. This is a privilege to be with you today and to discuss this very important subject. Something that is very near and dear to my heart as I have come out of Islam myself and converted to be a Christian, a Seventh-day Adventist Christian and for now I don’t know for a few decades and I’m thankful to God for bringing me and my family to this wonderful truth.
I love the people of the Islamic world. I come from it and my desire is to reach them with the Gospel. But this has been a lot of talk, denominational talk and not just in our church but in other denominations as well and regarding Islam.
Is Islam the same religion, at least is Islam’s God the same God as the God of the Christians? Is there a similarity between Christianity and Islam, specifically between Seventh-day Adventist Christianity and Islam? And who is Allah? Is he the God of the Bible? Can we trust him? Does he teach the same teachings that we read about in the Bible? And I don’t want to digress nor I want to move on to something too quickly but these are questions that need to be answered. A lot of people when I travel in different places, Adventists come and ask me, hey Pastor Shabazz, please tell us what do you think about this teaching that is being taught right now or what do you believe about Allah? Is he the God that we worship? And so everyone is asking this question everywhere I go. It doesn’t fail everywhere I go.
So this is something that we should be really opening up right now and bringing it to people’s attention. So we’re not in muddied waters anymore but we have a clear understanding of what is truth and separate truth from error. Absolutely.
That’s amazing that you talk about these things. Shabazz, I have of course not been as involved with Islam as you have because you come from there but I have dealt with people in the Islamic religion and when I was a professor at the university, my students, some of them were Islamic and there was a large group of Islamic students at our university and I always enjoyed working with them because they are so serious about their faith and many of them of course regard Christianity as rather frivolous because you know there aren’t these strict paradigms that the people uphold and they were always amazed because me also from an Adventist background, I was different to the others because I held to certain standards and norms which they appreciated and also on the issue of creation and evolution, they were very much for creation and therefore they were often very supportive of me and I found them very sincere and I have been longing to reach out to them so I share that sentiment but we are going to compare in our discussion two issues and two paradigms and two documents, one the Bible, the other one the Koran and the question is can they be reconciled, are they basically similar stories with a different angle or are they something else and yes for that of course I myself, I haven’t always been a Seventh-day Adventist Christian, I have been an atheist, I have been an occultist, I have been a Catholic, I had a whole series of stages in my life and when I was searching I studied Eastern religions, I studied Hinduism and I read the Koran very seriously as I would read the Bible so I am familiar with the Koran and its writings and yes we can have I think a fruitful discussion on this issue. You know, the thing that just kind of jumps at me is this notion that somehow because Ishmael was Abraham’s son, therefore because of that relation and Ishmael’s relation to the children of the East, specifically talking about the Arabs, that suddenly Islam is now a religion that is basically fostered or presented as a religion that is divinely mandated.
And that’s related to Christianity. Correct, yeah, so because of that Abrahamic connection, suddenly there’s three groups, there are the Christians, the Jews and the Muslims and they’re called the Abrahamic faiths and this is an important question. You know, Walter, when I used to work for Amazing Discoveries many years ago, in one of the videos that was produced on that channel, an imam responded to a particular presentation I did on the question of who is Allah and that imam agreed with me.
He said in the comment section of that channel, he said I completely agree with the speaker, the god of Christianity and the god of Islam are two different gods. Now, he meant it as evil toward us and good for him, but that was, and he’s right, and I am of a firm belief that the gods of Islam and these are two different gods, completely two different gods. We cannot connect them together, they’re just not the same personality.
Yes, so if I can get the ball rolling, I would like to compare, let’s say, the Bible with the Quran, just to get a basic picture. Number one, the Bible is a historic book, it contains a lot of history and that history has been corroborated by the spade of the archaeologist. You know, the science of archaeology is a very young science and basically it really only kicked off around about 1844 when it was possible to translate some of the cuneiform writings and decipher the hieroglyphics, etc.
So the Bible historically has been attacked in many, in many instances, but it has been corroborated and the excavations that are taking place in the Middle East are just amazing on that level. The Quran, on the other hand, is not really a historic document as I read it and some of the history is different or, let’s say, if compared to the Bible, one or the other must be out of sync, if I can put it that way, to put it mildly. Then the Bible also is a book of salvation and the Bible is a book of prophecy.
And again, the Quran is a description of events and a description of Allah and the relationship between Allah and his people, but it is not a prophetic book in the sense that the Bible is a prophetic book with very distinct prophecies, very distinct timelines, and these prophecies not only affect kingdoms and powers that would arise on this Earth and those that would play prominent roles in the history of humanity, culminating in the setting up of the Kingdom of God. And then the Quran and the Bible differ in terms of the central figure. The central figure in the Bible is the Messiah and you read the prophecies of Daniel and there are very accurate prophecies like Daniel chapter 8 and 9 that tell you exactly the year in which the Messiah would be born, what his mission would be, and then you pick it up in the New Testament and Christ fulfills every single one of those prophecies and they are exceedingly precise prophecies with timelines and events.
And it also talks about the change over from Israel, literal Israel, to spiritual Israel and it all revolves around this Messiah who in the New Testament is identified as Jesus Christ. And the big problem there for Islam or compared to Islam is that this Messiah is divine. So Jesus Christ is described in the Bible as the divine Messiah and John makes it quite clear in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God and that he is the creator, the one who spoke everything into existence.
Whereas Islam recognizes him only as a prophet. And then there are certain powers which are portrayed in the book of Daniel and in the book of Revelation that talks about a distorted Christianity that would be presented to the world, a false picture which Paul referred to as a falling away, and that another power would present itself as a Christian power and the reformers referred to that as the antichrist whom they identified with the papal system. Now none of that history is in the Quran and none of that timeline or prophecy is in the Quran.
So basically you’re dealing with people. Jesus is mentioned in the Quran. His mother is very prominent in the Quran.
In fact his mother is elevated to the position of the highest woman in heaven in the Quran. So we have some parallels and some issues but Jesus is only recognized as a prophet and there’s only one God and that is according to the Quran Allah and it is actually an insult to have Jesus elevated to the position of deity or even for him to to sacrifice his life for sins which is an insult to Allah because he needs no such machinations in order to save humanity. He can just do it by decree.
So there are very distinct differences. And Shabaz, from what I have studied on this issue, is that the Quran is very similar in its theology or the attributes of Allah are very similar in their theology to what is presented by the Roman Catholic system and therefore it is a reflection of Roman Catholicism. So in that sense there is a link between this so-called Christianity and the Quran.
But is the God of Catholicism the same God as that of the Bible? And here we have a link because the people out there want to have the deities the same. That Allah really is just another name for the same God that we have in Christianity. No, he has the same attributes as the Catholic portrayal of God but he doesn’t have the attributes that are portrayed in the Bible.
And if we can look at some of the similarities perhaps that would make it clearer and you must please give your comments regarding this. Number one, the Quran denies the atonement. Catholicism denies the atonement.
Catholicism teaches that Christ never died for you. He brought the perfect sacrifice by obedience but not for you. You have to pay your own sins in Catholicism because you have to go to a place called purgatory where you pay for your own sins.
Therefore Christ in Catholicism is not the sin bearer. He’s not the one who takes the penalty of sin, the wages of sin is death, upon himself. No, he was just obedient unto death but he never took the penalty of sin upon himself in Catholicism.
And therefore Islam when it teaches that there is no atonement, that that is a charade, it’s the exact same doctrine as Catholicism. That’s a core doctrine. When it comes to issues like Mariology, the Quran elevates Mary above all the other women in the Quran, even putting her above Fatima.
And then you have all of these connections. You have a place called Fatima in Catholicism where Mary is the pivotal point. And I’ve been to the Middle East where there are shrines where Islamic pilgrims come to communicate their wishes to Mary.
So this is very similar to what we have in Catholicism. So there’s no atonement. And then the other thing is that Jesus is just the mere prophet in the Quran as Muhammad was a prophet in the Quran.
And in Catholicism Jesus is basically a created being because Catholic teaching says that he was generated by the Father. So that makes him a created being. So that would put him on the same level as everybody else.
And he can be a prophet but he cannot be what the Bible claims that he is. So as far as I am concerned, the God of Islam is the same, or let’s put it this way, is the God with the same attributes as that of Catholicism. But that’s not the God of the Bible.
Do you see it like that as well? Absolutely. I completely agree with you. And the similarities between Islam and Catholicism, I’m not talking about what they show on a weekly basis in Catholic churches.
We’re talking about the underlying foundational connections between Catholicism and Islam is undeniable. It’s there. You can’t separate the two.
The God of Islam literally, I mean, in the Quran he denies that he has a son. And he even asks Jesus, he says, Jesus, and it’s interesting that every time Jesus is mentioned in the Quran, the title follows his name, Jesus the son of Mary. The son of Mary is all the time emphasized because the very purpose of Islam, I believe, was to not just to be a barrier against the progress of Christianity in the eastern countries, but it was also to to take away Jesus’s sonship to the Father in heaven.
And so that’s why in the Bible, Jesus is mentioned as the son of God in the New Testament and also in the Old Testament, at least in one verse. But in the Quran, he’s always the son of Mary. And you’re right, Mary is elevated.
Even just this last month in Tehran, in Iran, one of the metro stations, a brand new metro station that was just opened across the street from the largest Catholic church in Tehran. There is a metro station dedicated to Mary. Her image is in the metro station, a beautiful big image.
And it’s one of the most beautiful metro stations that you probably have ever visited. And not far from the Milad Tower in Tehran, there is a very big statue of Mary that has been dedicated. Now, here is an Islamic nation that has no problem with erecting images to Mary, or even dedicating metro stations and other things to Mary, but never Jesus.
And Mary is just looked upon with not just a regular respect. And so in Islam, Maryism is very much alive. And this is why I believe that Islam is being used as a decoy as well.
Let me just say this really quickly. I believe that Catholicism is using current events with Islam as a decoy to get people’s attention off of what the Catholic Church is doing and looking over on the other side, while the Catholic Church is planting and building and creating its empire and bringing the world to that final takeover that they’re planning to have. And they’ve been well, nice, successful anyways, they’ve already there.
And so, yeah, it’s so interesting. I appreciate the things you said, because I totally 100% agree with you. All right, there’s some core issues that are very important that people should understand as well.
And one of the very basic issues, which require a plan of salvation in the first place, is that the wages of sin is death. The day that you eat of it, says the scripture to Adam and Eve, is the day that you die. In other words, death will come in as a consequence.
Now, the doctrine of the immortality of the soul, again, is a Roman Catholic doctrine that has been transferred even to the other Christian denominations, and most Christian denominations, the great majority of them, believe in the immortality of the soul. Thus negating that very first statement in the Bible that you are mortal, because the Bible says God alone is immortal, and life is conditional to obedience. Now, if you have immortality, then what happens to those that disobey God? They go to hell, where they suffer eternal torment.
And this has been a central doctrine in Catholicism. And if you are saved, you first go to purgatory to be purged, because you have to bear your responsibility for your own sin. And if you go to heaven, what is that heaven going to be like? Well, normally there is a utopic description, whereas the Bible gives a totally different picture.
It’s a place where you will be in the presence of God, yes, but not in some form of utopia where you are pampered and receive a lot of ladies to take care of your needs and all of these issues. So the doctrine of this utopia or eternal damnation in hell is a Roman Catholic doctrine, and Islam has the same doctrine. But the Islamic doctrine on hell is so descriptive in the Quran, whereas in the Bible you have to look at types and shadows and cross-references to get the picture of what it is about.
This hell is the grave, and the other hell is the khyana, that fire of cleansing that destroys the wicked so that there are no more, whereas in Islam you are in this place of burning inferno where your skin is burnt off and you receive a new one every day so that you can feel the suffering and the pain all over and over again. So it reminds us almost of Dante’s Inferno. Yeah, right Martin? I just wanted to ask you now that you mentioned this, that sounds, all of this actually sounds a lot like mythology, like Egyptian mythology and all these other pagan religions.
And ancient Greek philosophy and all of these issues. So that is a totally synonymous view as we have it in Catholicism. And that is not biblical because God is not a monster that will torture you for all eternity on the basis of one short life that you’ve had here on earth.
And heaven is a place of activity. The Bible tells it that you will plant and you will take care of a farm, gardening, planting fruits, you will build houses, you will communicate with God and be in the city. And it’s a life of activity, whereas in the Quran you receive a couch and you lie down and you are served by individuals.
And it’s a totally different picture. But the very basic thing that you mentioned, Shahbaz, is Allah doesn’t have a son. So if he doesn’t have a son, can he be the same God as the God of the Bible? That is the million dollar question.
Really, this question wasn’t worth a million dollars until some Christian theologians decided to give it meaning. Because they started to teach that Allah is the same God as the God that we worship as Christians. And you know, there’s a surah in the Bible, the surah, and I was mentioning that when Allah asks Jesus and says, Jesus son of Mary, did you teach the Christians that you are equal to Allah and that you’re my son? And Jesus says, Allah most beneficent.
This is a lie that the heavens tremble at. So immediately that verse all by itself sets the Bible completely on some other place compared to the Quran. The Jesus of the Quran cannot be the Jesus of the Bible, because the Jesus of the Bible never denied his sonship to the father.
But in the Quran, he denies it. And the God of the Quran is not the ancient of days mentioned in Daniel chapter 7, because the God of the Quran says he has no son. But the ancient of days in the Bible, at Jesus’ baptism, his voice was heard clearly.
By everyone, that this is my son, in whom I’m well pleased. And then later on, on the Mount of Transfiguration, before that, later on, Jesus also is mentioned again by the father, this is my son, listen to him, obey him. So every Christian has to make this decision, this confusion that has come in the Christian camp about Islam has to be clarified.
Muslims have no problem by saying that we and Christians are not the same. But we Christians go out of our way to always claim that we are the same. We have so much in common.
They have a health message, we have a health message. Their God is the same God that we worship. And their father was Abraham, our father is Abraham.
And it’s just, it’s all like a confusion, a bedlam of noise. And I think it’s time. And it’s been, I mean, I’ve been working, I’ve been doing this ministry for 26 years.
And ever since 2000, I’ve been trying to teach this to my brothers and my sisters that, hey, you know, I haven’t made it a mission, because my mission is to save, bring people to know Jesus Christ. But on the sidelines, as much as I can, I try to make the issues clear, because I’m really tired of seeing people in our denomination that are just selling out, completely selling out. Sometimes they’re not selling out because they want to sell out, but they are compromising because they’ve either been deceived or they want to deceive people.
That’s the bottom line. You were mentioning that we have a health message and they have a health message. If I can just comment on that a little bit.
We have a health message, yes, which is based on what you read in Leviticus and in the history of the Israelites, where God changed their diets. And in the walk through the wilderness for 40 years, He even tried to get them to eat a more a healthy diet, excluding meat, for example. And they rebelled against it.
And there were very clear guidelines as to what kind of flesh foods you were allowed to eat. And those were the clean and unclean foods. And the list in Leviticus is quite exhaustive.
And as a scientist, I was very interested in this. And basically, if you can cut it down to the basics, the creatures that are unclean are those that will accumulate more toxins, either because of their lifestyle or because of accumulation due to carnivory, etc. All carnivorous animals are declared as unclean, for example.
And there are other issues like coprophagy, animals that eat their own excreta and things like that. And the list is very precise. When you go to the Koran, that list is very restricted.
The pig is declared as an unclean animal in the Koran. But the animals that are unclean in the Bible, like the animals in the ocean, for example, I’m not talking about fish with fins and scales. Now I’m talking about the other creepy crawlies like, you know, the mollusks and all of those creatures.
They’re perfectly fine in Islam. And these health laws that were mentioned in the Bible according to the Koran were decreed for the Jews because of their unbelief and disobedience, not because they were unclean within themselves. So in the Koran, the Muslim is quite happy to eat any of the marine creatures.
And the camel that is declared an unclean animal in the Bible is something that is definitely not unclean in the Koran. So there are a lot of contradictions there. So the health message basically revolves around pork and it revolves around things like alcohol, for example.
But one of the things that are unhealthy in the world is, for example, smoking. There’s no restriction when it comes to that. So as far as I’m concerned, there is basically no health message in Islam other than pork.
Well, in fact, in the Sharia law and in the Islamic tradition, a provision has been made that in times of dearth, when there is no other food, even the flesh of a pig is permissible to be consumed in Islam. So in times of dearth, you can eat the flesh of a pig in Islam. So there is absolutely no correlation, no connection between the Seventh-day Adventist health message or the biblical health message and the Koranic, as you mentioned.
They can eat the flesh of camels. They can eat any sea creatures. They don’t eat lobsters, but they do eat shrimps.
They do eat shellfish, most shellfish and stuff. They can eat ostrich meat, eggs, any type of birds and stuff they can eat. And you mentioned smoking.
Quran doesn’t have a Bible verse that says your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, that if you destroy this body, God will destroy you in hell. They don’t have any restrictions except eating the flesh of pigs or alcohol. And really, the reasoning behind this prohibition on alcohol and the meat of a pig, it goes back to the Islamic desire to reveal or at least show themselves that they are of an Abrahamic faith.
And because if that wasn’t even, if that was not in the Bible, today Muslims would be eating pigs and drinking alcohol and all that, and that would have been allowed. Muslim clerics regularly smoke cigarettes because there’s no prohibition. They have no belief that their body is a temple of the Holy Spirit.
Even though the Quran mentions Holy Spirit, but their understanding of the Holy Spirit is zero. Another correlation they make is that Jesus, the Quran says that Jesus is ruhullah, ruh, which is the same Semitic word as the ruha in Hebrew, which means spirit or breath. Allah is the name of the God of Islam.
So in the Quran, Jesus is referred to as ruhullah, which means that Jesus is the Holy Ghost. And you know that there is a teaching that’s been permeating in the Seventh-day Adventist Church for some years now, which is a false teaching that teaches that Jesus is the Spirit of God. But we believe as Protestant Christians, in the Godhead, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, three distinct, separate personalities that can exist apart from each other, but they are one in every aspect.
It’s not three in one, there are three as one. But this teaching in the Quran that Jesus is ruhullah, that he is the Holy Spirit, it goes back to that Catholic teaching because… It’s a Catholic doctrine. It’s a Catholic doctrine.
It’s a Catholic doctrine because in Catholicism, they teach that Jesus is generated by the Father, and that the Father and Jesus, once having been generated, together, sukhet, blew, breathed the Holy Spirit into existence. So basically, the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Christ and the Spirit of the Father, and they are basically one entity in Catholicism with three aspects. But the true trinity in the Bible is one in purpose, but three separate entities, individuals, powers.
If I may say something here that’s really going to stir something. The pioneers of this church, a lot of them, when you get these arguments, they say that they were anti-trinitarian or non-trinitarian. I believe if you really do your study, you’ll see that they’re non-Catholic trinitarian.
Absolutely, and they weren’t Unitarians either. Yes, they did not go against the biblical explanation of a triune God. No.
And so these people that run to that side and say, oh, but we, the Adventists, have the same view as the Catholics on trinity, have no clue what the Catholics teach on trinity. The irony is, Martin, that they actually teach Catholic doctrine by making Christ the generated being and the Holy Spirit the Spirit, basically, of Jesus Christ. And the interesting thing is, Walter and Martin, that Islam does the same thing.
That’s amazing. It’s Catholic teaching. It’s amazing how this just fits in together.
So if we can just backtrack a little bit and say, all right, what does the Bible say about end-time events and who the enemy of God really is in the portrayal of the book of Revelation and the little horn of Daniel chapter 7? The Reformers were absolutely crystal clear that the little horn represents the papacy. The Reformers were absolutely crystal clear that the beast of Revelation 13, the beast out of the sea, that that represented Catholicism because it had the same aspects as the beast or as the little horn. It persecuted the saints.
It changed times and laws, etc., etc. Now, Islam in the book of Revelation has a place, yes, when it came to, you know, the battle between Christianity and Islam. But the role players right unto the end remains the little horn power or the papal system that ruled for 1,260 days.
Now, Shabazz, if that is the antichrist system that changed the times and that changed the laws of God and has a mark which is their mark of authority which they claim, Sunday worship is their mark of authority, if that is true and that is the issue in the Bible, then Islam is in the same predicament as the rest of the world, even the Christian world. Because when they acknowledge the papal system and in their fraternity documents, they acknowledge each other as brothers in the religion. Isn’t it in the Abrahamic Accord? In the Abrahamic Accord as well.
Then if they embrace Catholicism as this leading power and eventually even may introduce the mark of authority of Rome, which is Sunday keeping, then they run the same risk as the rest of the Christian world of being deceived by a power that the Bible says will have control over the minds of men in the end of time. So, mustn’t they be warned in the same way in which the warning of the three angels’ messages has to go to the world? Doesn’t it apply to them as well? I would love to warn them that they are on dangerous ground by going into an alliance in the Abrahamic Accord with Catholicism and Judaism, both of whom deny the atonement. So, that accord is three religious systems that deny the divinity of Christ and the atonement.
And the fact that in this accord, which they called Chrislam, the one world religion complex that’s in Dubai, UAE, there is no seat for Protestants, at least for true Protestants anyways. It’s head by the Catholics. In fact, all the leaders usually go to the Vatican.
The Vatican never goes to them. And they have it in UAE because UAE is just, it was created for the globalists, that place. And in this accord, their entire premise is to destroy who Jesus, the Son of God is.
That’s the whole premise of this accord, is to take the world under the guise of this supposedly peaceful religious union that they have created. But really, everyone who has signed that accord has signed their soul over to the devil. That’s the bottom line.
I mean, it’s time for them to repent, but right now that’s what they’ve done. There’s no time for Christ in that equation, only by deception. I remember in your lecture, Islamic Connection, you show how all of this goes actually back to Luciferian worship, both Catholicism and Islam, because behind the scenes, you’ve got the exoteric and the esoteric doctrine that’s running there.
So most Muslims don’t know what’s the actual teaching of what’s behind the scenes and what’s the real religion. Yes. You see, false religion in Christianity, and I’m talking about papal religion, is based on the three lies of the serpent in the Garden of Eden.
You will surely not die, in other words, the doctrine of immortality. You shall be as God’s, and you will be able to distinguish between good and evil. You don’t need God’s law for that.
And Rome does exactly the same thing. They claim immortality. They say that Jesus became man so that man can become like God.
That’s in their catechism. And their basis for moral teaching is natural law and not the law of God. Therefore, they can change the law of God as it pleases them, and they have done so.
Now, when the Bible says that this power will set the mindset for humanity, then I ask myself the question, have they not done it in Judaism? Have they not done it in Islam? Have they not done it in the Christian world? Because the Christian world today, in its doctrine, is basically Catholic. It has totally negated the Reformation. So the whole world is following the mindset of the Roman Catholic system.
And the Roman Catholic system has overshadowed the world to such an extent that the Muslim is as a captive of their religion as is the Western world. Amen. Yeah, absolutely.
You know, you mentioned the law, the Ten Commandments, and when you read the Koran cover to cover, when you read the Hadith, whether it’s the Shia Hadith or the Sunni Hadith, you will never find the entirety of the Ten Commandments anywhere recorded in any of their doctrines. And so the Ten Commandments is non-existent in Islam. Now, there are particular sayings in the Koran that people have said, because I’ve heard Christians, even Adventist theologians tell me, oh, the Ten Commandments is in the Koran.
But it’s not. You do not have the entirety of the Ten Commandments. Now, you have somewhere it says, Allah says, you’re not to worship any other gods.
They say, see, that’s the Ten Commandments. But it’s not in its entirety. For instance, the Sabbath Commandment is not even mentioned in the Koran.
In the Koran, it says that, talks about the Jews, that the Jews said that there was, there’s a Sabbath, talks about the Sabbath like that, but then the Koran brings it right back around to Juma, or the day of Ummah, the day that Muslims are supposed to gather, which is Friday, and which, so in the Koran, Allah says, I’ve given you Juma as your day. And it’s not a full day. It’s not like a Sabbath to them.
Muslims go to the mosque, they leave the mosque, they go back to their secular jobs, they do whatever they want to do, but there is no placement. So in Catholicism, Sunday takes the place of the Sabbath. In Islam, Friday takes the place of the Sabbath.
And Sabbath is negated in all these religions. We’re talking about 1.7 billion Muslims, and we’re talking about another billion Catholics, they are all negating the commandments of God. All of it is being negated.
Christ is being negated. His sonship to the Father is being negated. His divine purpose, He as the Creator is being negated.
I want to just tell you something. I had a Muslim one time come to me. I was doing an evangelistic seminar in San Jose, California, for Iranians.
And an Iranian Muslim, middle of the seminar, I think it was day 16, I see this new guy and at the end of the meetings, I went over to shake his hand and he got up and said, I have not come here to listen to you. My sole mission is to bring you back to Islam. And I said to him, I said, what is your problem that I became a Christian? And he said, Christianity is a false religion.
Christianity is a corrupt religion. And Islam is the only true religion. Allah is the only true God.
And I told him, I said, so you have a problem with Jesus, don’t you? He says, yes, Christians teach that He is God. And I said to him, I can prove that to you from scriptures, but I know you don’t accept scriptures. And he said, no, I don’t accept the Bible at all, except the writings of Moses.
Only the Torah, the first five books of Moses. And many, many Muslims regard the writings of Moses as intact. They’re not corrupted, but the rest is corrupted.
I told him, if I show you from the writings of Moses that Jesus is God, will you follow him? He said, it’s impossible. It’s not there. I said, well, let me show you.
So he and I went to somewhere private and opened my Bible, took him to Genesis chapter one, verse one. In the beginning, Elohim created the heavens and the earth. And I explained to him what Elohim means in the Hebrew, original Hebrew.
And then he said, he said, okay, what does that mean? And I took him down to Genesis chapter one, verse 26, 27, when he says, and God said, let us make man in our image. Let us make him in our likeness. In the likeness of God, God created them.
He created them male and female. And then he said, who is this us speaking here? He said, I don’t know. I said, this has nothing to do, because in the Quran, Allah refers to himself as us, we.
He’s not talking about polarity, multiplicity here. He’s talking about in the Arabic religion, in the formal format of the Arabic religion, if I was to speak to you, Walter or Martin, I wouldn’t use the word you singular. I would use the, it’s like in French, the word vous, which is plural, because I’m trying to respect you.
They do that to monarchy as well. They do it in Persian, in Arabic, in French, in many languages, it’s built that way. That’s why Quran was written that way.
And I told him Bible was not written that way. And he said, so who’s talking here? I asked him, do you think it’s the angels? And he thought about it. He says, well, I don’t think angels can create.
I said, no, he’s talking to someone. So I told him, well, let’s go to Genesis chapter 11, took him to where God said, and God came and he confounded the languages. He divided the languages.
Let us, let us confound their languages. And then he said, and then, and then I took him to John. Now I could take him to New Testament because I built his confidence from the writings of Moses, took him to New Testament, John chapter one, verse one.
And, and it says in the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God and everything was made by the word. And the word in verse 14 became flesh. The minute he heard all of this, I tell you, he tiptoed backwards.
He hit the wall behind him. And then he said, maybe I need to become a Christian. And he ran to his car.
He turned that engine on. He revved that engine. He took off.
He never came back. Never saw him again. But I pray that he has become a Christian since.
So the point is this, is that Muslims argue that the Bible is corrupt. And my, my response to them has always been, if you believe that the Bible is corrupted and you believe that its origins were good, that, that you say Allah gave the Bible, but the Bible was corrupted. So Allah was forced to bring the Quran.
What guarantee do I have that that same Allah that failed the first time from protecting his own word will not fail again? And no Muslim can ever answer that question. There’s no answer to that question. What was that? I said, that’s a very good point.
If you, if you had to go deeper into the Torah and show him the plan of salvation in the sanctuary system, that is all about Jesus. And when, when Moses speaks about a prophet like him that would come, they related to Muhammad, but the prophecies related to Jesus Christ, because they even give the timelines exactly in, in the Bible. So yes, that, that is a story.
Now I have a very similar story. Well, not a similar story, but a story. I had a visit from an Islamic lady from Saudi Arabia and she came to my house and she wanted to consult with me.
And she was a strict Muslim, but she had a problem with the position of women within the Quran and the position of women in the future life thereafter. And she, she was basically saddened by this doctrine that the woman is basically there to serve basically the needs of the man, whereas in the Bible, of course, Adam and Eve were co-equals. She was placed by his side, not under his feet.
So she came to me and she asked me, I must in, in one sentence, tell her what the difference is between Christianity and Islam. And I, I said, the difference is, for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever should believe in him should not perish, but have eternal life. And she said, no, she can’t accept that because she doesn’t accept the deity of Christ and, or the sonship of Christ.
And so I did the same thing you did. I gave her a Bible study. And when I’d done the Bible study, she said, now she’s totally shocked because then Jesus is, is who he claims to be.
Then he is God because it’s in the Bible. And I did very similar thing to what you did. And then she said to me, what are the attributes of these God, this God, and what is the position of the woman? Now, if you read the Quran, it’s very, very clear that a woman doesn’t reach the same stature as a man.
For example, if you are in a court case, they have to be two women for each one man. Also in the, in inheritance and all of these issues, the woman takes a very secondary role. And I explained to her the co-equality, but that there is a hierarchy, but that it’s based on love and respect for each other on the same level.
And she burst into tears and she says, but I want that God. I want that God. And I said to her, you can have that God.
And she says, but if I go back to my country and I show that I have this God, they will kill me. And I said, well, I understand your predicament, but I don’t know what to tell you on that issue other than that you can keep it in your heart. And so she actually knelt down with me and we prayed and then she left.
And I don’t know what happened to her there after, but there is this terrible longing for a God that loves you, that wants to take care of you, that’s prepared to even die for you rather than this separated God who looks at you and sees whether you come up to scratch or not. And on the basis of an arbitrary choice takes you to heaven or condemns you to eternal hell. Amen.
Praise, praise be to God. I am confident that she’s following her savior today. The seed was planted.
This is beautiful, beautiful testimony. My heart is longing to see every Muslim become a believer of Christ and follow him. I have some, I want to just give you some good news in the country that I represent.
I’m originally, I’m from Iran. And in Iran, according to Gammon, which is an institution in the Netherlands, and they do statistics and they collect data. They did a research on Iran.
It took them, I think, three or four years to gather all the data. And they concluded, this is about three years ago, maybe four years ago, this came out, that Iran has the fastest growing Christian church in the world. The church in Iran is growing at a rate of literally almost 20% annually.
And the statistics said that 60% of Iranians have already left Islam in their hearts. They are not Muslims anymore. And many have become either Zoroastrians, many have become atheists, and many, many more have become Christians.
And 40% of Iranians still consider themselves as Muslim as of five years, four or five years ago. Out of that 40%, only 2% practice Islam on a daily basis. The other 38% do not go to the mosque.
In fact, in Iran, mosques are closing at a rate that is unbelievable. And by one news commentator said that in one of these popular news media channels, he said, Iran is the first post-Islamic nation the world has ever seen. Muslims are looking not just in Iran, in Egypt, in Saudi Arabia, many countries in the region, people are turning to Christ, angels are visiting people, people are having visions and dreams, and they’re seeing the truth, and they are converting.
And our job, our ministry is to reach them, and to tell them, and to help them to understand, so that in this transition, they know where they’re supposed to go, where is their support system. Obviously, Jesus is their support, first and foremost. But where the church exists, they can turn to that church.
And right now, in Iran, we have many, many, many underground churches, Adventist underground churches, that are every Sabbath, they’re worshiping, and they’re honoring Christ, and they are growing. This ministry is growing, leaps and bounds, and God is working in a mighty way. We’re going to see a lot of Muslims come to Christ very soon.
But I wanted to point to one thing, Walter and Martin, and that was, that’s in Genesis, because everybody talks about, there’s a well-known author in the Seventh-day Adventist Church, he wrote a book called Islam, God’s Forgotten Blessing. And his is that Islam is a blessing that has been forgotten. And he’s using the couple of times that the Muslim forces basically attacked Europe, and because of that, the Reformation movement was saved.
Remember, the soldiers, the Catholic military, the Catholic soldiers that were attacking the Reformers, then there would be a loud cry that the Muslims are attacking our southern border, so they would retreat and go back to defend the borders. And a couple of three times, even the Caliph admitted, hey, God is using me to save the Protestants. The thing is, they use these arguments to prove that Islam is a blessing.
But wait a minute, I thought that Cyrus and the Persians, who did not worship the true God of Israel, they also saved Israel from their captivity. But God never said that the Jews are supposed to become Zoroastrians now, or worship Mitra. But you know, God is sovereign.
He can use even his enemies for his purpose. He does it. He does it all the time.
I say he does that all the time. All the time. And the verse that I want to mention is in Genesis chapter 16, verse 12, where the angel of the Lord meets with Hagar and tells Hagar, in chapters 16, verse 7 through 14, he’s talking to Hagar, and he says to Hagar, where are you going? I’m fleeing from my mistress, Sarai.
And the angel says, you have to go back to your mistress. You have a son, his name shall be called Ishmael. So okay, unique, because now God is actually giving the name of the son of this Egyptian bondwoman.
Well, not a bondwoman, but she was, Sarai was her mistress. And then the angel says, he will be a wild man, his hand will be against all men, and all men’s hand will be against him. The word wild man there is translated from the original Hebrew, which says wild donkey.
He will be a wild donkey, kicking, you can’t tame him. He’s just going to be a wild kicking donkey. His hand will be against everyone, and everyone will be against him.
Basically, there is a prophecy of Islam right there, through Ishmael, and his connection with the Arabs. And in fact, he didn’t even move, he went to the wilderness of Paran, and it was his children that mixed with the Arabs. And his wife was an Egyptian wife, that his mother picked for him from Egypt, because his mother is Egyptian.
Ishmael is three-fourth, his only children, his children are three-fourth Egyptian. He’s only half Semitic from his father, and half Egyptian, North African. I’m not arguing that Muslims are not Ishmaelites, but what I’m saying, not all Arabs are Ishmaelites, and not all Ishmaelites are Arabs.
And so the fact that the Bible predicts there’s a prophecy about Islam, there will be a wild religion, it will be always fighting everyone, and everybody will be fighting it. We’re seeing that on the news every day. It’s happening all the time.
Well, there’s a greater connection also via Esau, because Esau also intermarried with Ishmaelites. So, there is that connection, and it’s interesting that Petra, for example, was a very big religious center, and Mecca is a much later construct, and happens to be on a pagan ley line of religious systems. So, there’s a whole issue there as well.
God wants to save all nations, because the gospel is for every tribe and people and nation. And there will be seed of Abraham, even through the line of Ishmael, that will accept Jesus. And there are web pages now that tell about all of these miraculous dreams that people are having, that Jesus is the true Messiah, that he will come again.
But there’s another aspect about the Bible and Quran that’s interesting, and that is the question of free choice. In the Bible, you have angelic beings that are described, and you have humanity that’s being described. So, there are two orders of being.
In the Quran, there are three orders of being. You have the angels, then you have the genii, and then you have humanity. And when in the Quran, Allah told the genii that they must bow down to humanity and be subjugated to them, they refused.
And so, they have a freedom of choice. But according to the Quran, the angelic host doesn’t have a freedom of choice, and humanity has a freedom of choice. And they have this intermingling, this confusion of the genii with Idlib, the leader of the genii.
And in the Quran, these entities actually were instrumental in building the temple in Jerusalem. So, that wasn’t something that Solomon did, but that genii actually helped to construct. So, you have basically demonic entities involved in the building of the temple.
So, there’s a total confusion as to that part of their religion as well. And yes, is it like that or is it not? Are there good genii like you see in the movies when the genie comes out of the bottle, and bad genii that will try to deceive you? But basically, according to the Quran, a Muslim cannot be deceived, only the Christian can be deceived. Now, I had this question when I did Islamic Connection, whether Rome that was supposed to rule from 538 to 1798 and Islam arrives after 538, whether in the secret echelons of the underground currents of secret societies, whether there wasn’t some concord between them and Islam might have been used to get rid of true Sabbath-keeping Christianity in the Eastern churches so that Rome would be able to rule because the Islamic religion is the same as Catholicism as we have discussed.
They even use beads for praying. They’ve got the same emblems and stuff on the churches. They have the moon and the star in it, which is the Roman Catholic monstrance with the host in it.
It’s basically a relic of Baal worship. So, you have all of these issues. So, is that not plausible? And why do the secret societies like the Shriners, for example, wear a fez with the Islamic symbols on it, plus the Islamic sword that was used to destroy Christianity and by chopping off the head, which is a feature of ISIS, for example.
And why do these secret societies and these Freemasons honor Islam and the fez, which was a of the blood shed by the Christians in the river Fez? So, we know that the higher Masonic echelons are Luciferian. So, obviously, they must have the same doctrine as the Luciferians. And they put the Quran and the Bible on the same level because they teach the same doctrine as interpreted by Catholicism and Israel and not really the Bible.
I’ve got two questions. The one is the Mark of the Beast. How will Islam accept the Mark? What are they going to do? How is that going to be working to try and implement the Mark of the Beast? And then you’ve been talking about Shabazz.
I’ve heard preachers in our denomination say that the reason why we can have similarities by Allah and God is because the root word for God is actually more pagan than the word Allah is for God. Is that true? Can you just explain on those two questions? What’s your take? That is so sad. Now, the English word, if they’re talking about the English word God, obviously the English word God is just a neutral word in the English language which has evolved.
And it represents any deity in any religion, obviously. So, you can argue that. But that’s not a strong argument.
That’s not theology. That’s not taking a word in pieces. Allah predates Islam, the name Allah.
And the name Allah has an address, has a direction. When you say Buddha, everybody knows what you’re talking about. When you say Allah, everyone knows what you’re talking about.
Muhammad, the prophet of Islam, his father’s name was Abdullah, which means, that’s an Arabic word, which means the servant of Allah. And obviously, his father was either named Abdullah or he actually was a priest that served Allah, pre-Islamic Allah in Arabia. That means that Allah was already worshipped by Arabs before Islam even became a religion in that region.
So, you can have the cart before the horse. Muhammad’s father was born before Muhammad. At his birth, they named him Abdullah.
And when Muhammad comes on the scene, and I know now there are historians that even challenge whether or not he even existed, and even Mecca even existed. But when he comes on the scene in Mecca, or Mecca or however you pronounce it, he comes and there’s this square building called Kaaba. And Arabs at that time worshipped 300 deities.
And the number one deity they worshipped was Allah. It was a black stone that was actually a meteor that had come down from the sky and from space. And they found this meteor and it’s metallic and it’s black.
And they put it in Kaaba and they said this is the god that came down from moon and they worshipped it. Muhammad comes on the scene, he gets rid of 299 of those idols. And he takes that last one and he says this is not Allah.
This is the eye of Allah. That’s why in Kaaba, if you look in Kaaba, if you go look, research it, that black stone is encased in a golden eye, shape of an eye, and it’s in Kaaba. And every Muslim, faithful Muslim goes to the pilgrimage and they go around the Kaaba seven times worshipping that stone.
And so Allah predates Islam. Some people even argue, well, Elohim is a form of Allah. Absolutely not.
This is nonsense. Everybody’s so desperate to make an ecumenical mess out of our divided world that we’re willing to just negate every immoral differences just for the sake of unity. But there can’t be unity when truth is being compromised.
And this is the problem that we’re having even now in our church to a great degree. And I’m not condemning the Seventh-day Adventist church. I love the Seventh-day Adventist church.
All of us are serving God’s church and we will continue to serve the church. But we are having problems and we got to call it out. This is my take on it.
I would love to hear what you gentlemen think. I think exactly the same thing. And I’ve had high officials within our ranks come to me and say that Islam, the Muslim doesn’t have to come out of his system because the only difference is a cultural system.
He can stay in his mosque, he can stay in his worship system. I used to be a Roman Catholic. I had to come out of the system.
I cannot be part of Roman Catholicism which is the beast of revelation and has the dragon giving him his power and his seat in great authority. I cannot stay within that system. I have to come out and be separate.
The same applies to Islam. Now you mentioned the I and the I is so important. Now just jump to Catholicism.
How important is the all-seeing I in Catholicism? It’s important right from the very beginning. You have it in many many cases and then of course it’s perfected in Jesuitism. In every Jesuit conclave there is the all-seeing I and why should that very same symbol be the same symbol that you find in masonry which is basically Luciferian worship and you find it in the occult world.
You find it all over and all of these things point to one basic form of worship which is Luciferian. Now if the true deity that is served by these entities is Lucifer and I cannot see it any other way because they believe his doctrine and they follow the lies of the serpent from the Garden of Eden and immortalize them in their doctrines then they must be Luciferian at heart and that is an esoteric doctrine which the initiates would know about and there is an exoteric doctrine that the uninitiated is kept in slavery to and I believe exactly the same that happened in Catholicism is happening in Islam and these poor people have to go through rituals. They have to their prayer times in specific places.
If you follow the ritual then you’re fine. Catholicism does the same thing. If you pray your rosary, if you go to the mass, if you do your pilgrimages then you get points and you get absolutions from purgatory.
The same with Islam. You have to do a pilgrimage. It’s a religion of works.
It is not the religion of the Bible and therefore these brethren of ours that ask for the blessing of Allah for example are inadvertently in my opinion practicing what the occult world is practicing and what Catholicism is practicing. It’s a very dangerous precedent. There are only two systems and the one is based on the messiah, faith in the messiah and obedience to his precepts.
Everybody who deviates from obedience to his precepts and acceptance of his atoning sacrifice is in a false religion no matter what we’re going to call it. Yeah absolutely, absolutely. You know there is this, you talked about the genii in the Quran that you read about and when I was a kid I remember we were always scared you know that the genii will come and get you and all that and you never thought about fallen angels or angels.
Angels were kind of like dismissed. Geniis were the ones that were the boogeyman and that you had to be scared of and stuff and the devil has worked really hard to get the attention off of himself, hide himself and create this scary situation to control people through fear and all these false religions control people through fear and that’s what Catholicism does as well, controls people through fear. If you don’t obey you’re going to burn in hell, you’re going to be in purgatory for so long and then you’re going to be this and you’re going to be that and I remember when I first became a Seventh-day Adventist, just shortly before I became a Seventh-day Adventist, I remember I was praying to Allah and I was literally beating my body trying to appease Allah to get him to listen to me and that’s when he didn’t listen to me and that’s when I fell to the floor and I was crying and I didn’t say Allah anymore, I used the word God.
This is proof, this is a case in point. In my case, in my experience when I met Jesus I was literally calling Allah and nothing happened and I was crying, I was weeping, I was beating my body, I wanted forgiveness, I needed to be forgiven. I was 18 years old and during that traumatic experience I was having, at the end of it I just gave up, I fell to the floor, I was weeping, weeping like a baby and I cried the last words that I said.
These were the final words I was saying and I was giving up and I said I didn’t say Allah anymore, I used the word God which is neutral. The word God is neutral obviously and I said God please help me. The minute I said that Jesus showed up in my room, he actually appeared in the middle of my room.
Now I’m praying for 40 minutes, Allah, Allah, Allah, beating myself, crying and asking for help, nothing happens but he couldn’t come. Had Jesus showed up when I said Allah, he would have one denied himself and two, I would have remained a Muslim, I would have never become a Christian and but Jesus showed up as Jesus not as Allah and changed my life, my life changed and I became a believer and so did all my family members eventually one by one and they met Jesus in their dreams as well. So yes, this question of Allah is clear, even a Muslim imam agreed with me although he took it as a point for himself but you know the final thing that really stands out in this discussion also just equally is eschatology.
The eschatological views of Islam regarding what happens at the end of time when everything ends and judgment has come and all that and there are so many people in the church that cry and say, oh we are all the same with the Muslims, they have eschatology, we have one, Jesus comes, they say Jesus will come and all that and the question is, is it really the same? Is our eschatology and their eschatology the same? Are they teaching the same? In fact, do they even have a theology that we can actually rest on and look at it as a solid way of theologically understanding, line upon line, here a little, there a little. As Walter mentioned earlier in the program, Quran is, you don’t find many things in the Quran. In fact, the Quran was written in a very confusing way.
There is no line of reasoning and it is disorganized. There is no theology, there is no line upon line here, line upon line here a little, there a little that you can compare verses and come out with a theology. There is no two or three witnesses if they agree so it’s established, a way that we as Christians study the Bible.
So, these are the things that we need to talk about. I would like to hear what you have to say about the eschatology of the Quran and the Bible and the second, supposedly the second coming of when Mahdi will come back at the end and Jesus supposed to be coming right behind him and the end will come. Okay, let’s look at these two aspects about the eschatology and the Bible and the Quran as a book.
Let’s first look at the Quran and the Bible as a book. Catholicism does not accept the Bible as normative only in the sense as it is in harmony with their tradition. So, tradition is above the Bible in Catholicism.
In true religion, the Bible is above your tradition. You have to come into harmony with your tradition. In the Quran, as you say, there are many confusing things and I believe the Quran also confuses Mary with the sister of Moses rather than the mother of Jesus at a much later stage.
So, there are many confusing things there in the Quran. The Quran’s value in Islamic life is basically in song. There is a divine reading of the Quran which is done and the method of reading it rather than the content of what you are reading is important.
The way you pronounce it, the way you sing it, etc. Now, in Catholicism, you have the same. In Catholicism, you have what you call Lectio Divina, divine reading, where the Psalms and the verses in the Bible are sung in a particular chanting fashion.
That’s a correlation with Islam. It’s exactly the same thing. And there would be a singer and a reciprocity response and you have the same also in Islam.
So, it is totally the same as Catholicism and Catholicism is a pagan religion. It’s not Christianity. So, that’s the one point.
When it comes to eschatology, many in Islam long for the coming of Jesus because Jesus in the Quran denies anyone or will punish anyone that has deified him. So, in Islam, the coming of Christ is a retributive action. He comes to punish those that worshipped him as deity, whereas in the Bible, he comes to gather those that worshipped him as deity.
So, it’s the exact opposite. So, the eschatology is the destruction of Christianity and the survival of Islam, whereas in the Bible, it is all that come into harmony with God and keep his commandments and accept the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ are embraced in the kingdom of God. It’s a universal message of salvation and not the destruction of one in favor of the other.
Beautiful. Praise God. That’s absolutely correct.
Absolutely right. And this is the whole purpose of Islam to take away the deity of Christ. You know, five times a day when the call to prayer is done at the minarets in all the mosques around the world, Sunni religion and the Shia religion is done three times a day.
Part of that call to prayer is the denouncing of anyone that claims to be equal to Allah, that Allah has no consort. So, five times a day, they proclaim from the minaret. The whole purpose and existence of Islam was to deny the deity of Christ.
That’s the whole purpose of Islam is to that and also create a barrier against the growth of Protestant Christianity in the East and it became a wall. You know, another interesting thing about the eschatology of Islam is the teaching that they believe that when Mahdi will come, Christ will come after him and then Christ’s whole purpose is to fulfill whatever Mahdi says and obviously the most important thing is to destroy those who defied him. But he also will kill 70,000 Jews, only 70,000 Jews, and he will proceed to kill all pigs on earth.
Every four-legged animal creature we call pig will be killed. All hogs, pigs, boars, all of them, Jesus will kill all of them. His job is finished.
His job is finished. Jesus will get married, have children, and die after 40 years. But Mahdi will live forever and I ask those in our denomination that teach that we have a similar eschatology as they do.
Where do you see the similarity? How can you connect these dots that don’t even exist? Now in the esoteric world and in some denominations that call themselves Christian, that are not Christian, there are these two sons of God. The one is Jesus and the other one is Lucifer and they believe that Lucifer was the elder one, the true son of God, and Jesus was the usurper and that Lucifer will take his throne back. Now there are even denominations that call themselves Christian that believe that.
Let’s not go into into that detail but that is what the esoteric world believes and therefore they worship Lucifer as the ultimate winner. Now as you have just explained, this Iman Mahdi who will come and Jesus will follow him. Isn’t that a depiction of the same thing where Lucifer, the true son of God according to them, is the one that lives forever and the other one is denigrated to humanity and will die and disappear off the stage of history.
So all of these religions out there are a negation of Christ. Yeah, bringing him lower. And the most deceptive one is Catholicism and that what makes it the son of perdition, the denier, the betrayer of Jesus Christ.
You know this word son of perdition is used only for Judas and for the man of sin. They pretend to worship Jesus whereas they deflect the worship to Mary and other entities like the saints that are all deceased. They deny the divinity, the true self-sustaining divinity of Christ and make him a created being and present that to the Christian world as though they were Christians.
They’re not. They are the enemies of Christ. They are Luciferian in their worship.
I had a man who grew up in an Imam family who told me that he once overheard a group of Imams in his family worshipping a secret form of Allah which was basically occult behind the scenes. And because he overheard it, he had to take part in that ritual eventually and become initiated. So again you have, it seems to me from that story, and it’s a very credible source, that you also have an esoteric and an exoteric portrayal of the religion for the insiders and the outsiders.
Of course masonry is very prominent in Islam as well and you have all the Islamic lodges and behind the scenes they are actually one in worship but externally they are not. So this is very fascinating to me. There’s only one true religion as far as I can understand that corroborated not only through faith but through actual historic data and prophetic data.
And you will only find that in the Bible. You will find it in no other writing. Amen, amen, amen.
Praise God. I am so blessed to spend this time with you gentlemen and just a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful. And I wanted to say that in our mission to reach people whether they are Catholic or Muslims or Protestants or Buddhists or Hindus or whatever they may be, that truth will prevail.
Truth always prevails and error has no place, cannot even stand in the truth. Now people may hold on to error and think that error is going to be victorious. People ask me, how do you minister to a Muslim? And I tell them, read them for the Bible.
God has promised that if you cast your bread it will return to you. The word of God will not return to me that Jesus says void. So his word will not return to him void.
And people are scared of sharing the Bible with Muslims. And I tell them, no, just like you did Walter with that Arab woman from Saudi Arabia, you study the Bible with her. Yes.
What else can you do? The word of God is the only truth that we can rest our faith upon. And it is a living word of God and it has power. Every time I open the Bible, I hear noises, not psychologically, but spiritually.
I hear the noises of beasts and I see nations and I see the future and I see the past and I see history. I see the truth of God. I see the cross of Jesus.
I see the agonizing of the son of God. I see his victory over sin, over death. And I see that I can have life and have it more abundantly through Jesus Christ.
And when I share this word with anyone, whether they are Muslim or not, it will not return to void. Somewhere there will be a response. They may say, no, that within itself is a response, but it will accomplish that which God has said for it to be to do.
And this word will accomplish. Let’s not be ashamed of the word of God and hide it. Let’s share it, whether it’s a Muslim or not.
And don’t worry about whether or not they believe that the Bible is corrupt or not. Just you read it because your faith in the Bible is contagious. When you believe the Bible with all your heart, with all your mind, with all your soul, with all your life, no one can deny you.
No one can deny you. Sorry, I get emotional, but that’s my love. It’s wonderful.
The day you said, God, help me. That’s when you got your answer. I sat in a Catholic church and I said, if you exist, God, reveal yourself to me.
Where did he take me? He took me to the Bible. And I came out of that system in the same way a Muslim must come out of that system because he’s been deceived and he must accept the truth as it is in the scriptures. That system is linked to Babylon.
Yes. And the third, second angel’s message is come out. Come out of her.
And that brings, I’m sorry, but I just want to take you guys back just to this one place. Because the third angel’s message is don’t take the mark of the beast. Why will a Muslim, what will be the, how will that affect him? The Muslim doesn’t really have a rest day.
That’s what Shabazz said. Friday is just a lunchtime prayer. There’s no rest day.
And humanity needs a rest day. And the Muslim world, in conjunction with the Western world, has already accepted Sunday as a rest day. Also in terms of commerce and banking.
Perfect. So there is no reason why you shouldn’t accept the mark of the beast and accept the authority of Catholicism. He’s already gone into a triune union with him and the Abrahamic record.
And which is run by the Catholic church. And you can go and look at the buildings that have been erected for the Abrahamic accord. They’re not based on Protestantism, the Christian one.
It’s based on Catholicism. The whole architecture, everything associated with it is based on Catholicism. It’s not biblical.
Thank you. Because it’s just, I hear that question every time coming. And I just want people to know that that’s not the stumbling block that’s going to keep them from implementing the mark of the beast.
And because we’re dealing with a very difficult situation of reaching the people that are in that window, God is actually intervening through prayer, I mean, through visions and through dreams that people are having for them personally. Isn’t that also a fulfillment of the prophecy of Joel, that the young people and the men and the women will have dreams and God will lead? Because God is in the business of saving souls, not in condemning souls. He didn’t come to condemn, he came to save.
He’s a God of love. He’s a God of equality. And the Islamic world needs to be freed from the shackles of their theology, as much as the Roman Catholic needs to be freed, or the occultist, or the Hindu, or the Buddhist, or the Shaman, or whatever you want to call them.
The Jew. The Jew. All of them.
The Jew has recognized that the time of Daniel chapter 9 has passed because of their unbelief. No. Then come back to belief and accept that the Messiah that was prefigured in their sacrificial system is their Messiah.
Don’t accept a spurious Messiah that will come and wipe out your enemies so that you can rule. We are all of one blood. We are all children of God.
And Ishmael is a son of Abraham, but Abraham goes all the way back to being a son of God because he was created by God through Adam. Amen. And also, in the covenant that Paul mentions in Galatians, the two covenants, the covenant, one from Mount Sinai, Hagar, because he says Abraham had two sons, and then he says, talks about Isaac, and talks about Ishmael, and says, and then talks about Jerusalem above, and then talks about Mount Sinai.
One gendereth to bondage, the other one is freedom. One persecutes the other one, and the one that gendereth to bondage persecutes the one that’s free. So for those that claim that Paul taught that Islam is the religion that came from God, then Paul here clearly says, he makes a distinction between these two covenants, and he calls one Hagar, and Ishmael, and the other one is Isaac, and Jerusalem above, our mother, Jerusalem above.
So the freedom that Muslims will feel will only come to them when they find Christ, like I did, and like many millions of other Muslims that have become Christians and believers, who finally, the shackles fell off, they were freed, they came forward, and they’re now standing in freedom in Jesus Christ. And I might add that when Jesus revealed to me the Sabbath, the night that he showed me the Sabbath, it was in a dream, and in my dream, a Seventh-day Adventist Bible co-porter had already told me about the Sabbath, and I didn’t know if it was true or not, so I prayed, and I asked Jesus, I said, Lord, show me if this is really true, if this is your Sabbath, and that night he gave me that dream, and in my dream he showed me the Sabbath, and it stood out, and I was actually standing next to a Seventh-day Adventist church, and it was Sabbath, it was Saturday, but the day was alive, there was this active electricity that was vibing in the air, something that only with spiritual eyes you can see, and in my dream, that spiritual eye was given to me, and then God showed me the Bible, and next to it, he showed me the writings of what we call the spirit of prophecy, and I had no idea that there was even a spirit of prophecy at that moment, all of that was shown to me in my dream, and in my dream, a basement was shown to me in a church, and that basement, later on, I was baptized in that church, and I went into that basement where they had fellowship, they would have their Sabbath, Saturday on Sabbath, they would have potluck in that basement, I stood in that same basement that I had seen in my dream, I’ve never been in that basement before, all of that was revealed to me in my dream, and the writings of spirit of prophecy, the writings of Ellen G. White was revealed to me, shown to me in my dream, all of that, so God is working, yes, as he mentioned in the book of Joel, this is happening in a large sense, why is it happening in a large sense to Muslims? Part of the reason is that God told Abraham, for your sake, I will bless your son Ishmael, it was never in God’s plan for him to have a son named Ishmael, but husband and wife took it upon themselves to go and be God’s for a moment, and they believed Lucifer, they were standing at the tree, they can be like God, so they decided, let’s make a child so we can fulfill God’s promise, so they made a child with him, taking Hagar, and now God says, okay, you put yourself and you put me in a special predicament, just like Peter put Christ in a predicament and had boasted that Jesus will pay tax, and Jesus said, you should have not said that, but now because you’ve said it, go, there’s going to be a fish, and there’s going to be money in his mouth, you take that money, and you pay your tax and my tax. Abraham and Sarah did the same thing, they put God in a predicament, so now God says, okay, Abraham, because of you, I will bless your son Ishmael, I will bless him, but he is not the chosen blessing, that blessing will come through Isaac, and because of that promise, God is working very diligently and hard to reach Muslims with the gospel of Jesus Christ, and it’s paying off, praise God, paying off all over the place.
I agree with you 100 percent, what they need to understand regarding the Sabbath, the Sabbath is resting in a completed work that God did and not we did. Pagan religion, all false religion is based on what we can accomplish, and Hagar is Abraham’s effort to fulfill God’s promise, whereas Sarah is God’s promise that even the baron will be able to bring forth life, and that is salvation by faith compared with salvation through your own efforts, that’s why the religion of Catholicism is one of rituals and sacraments, sacramental activities and pilgrimages and indulgences, and Islam is exactly the same, a religion of ritual and works and beads and pilgrimages and own effort, and God is looking to see who comes up and steps up to the plate, and the ultimate sacrifice is if you give your life for the cause of Allah, you go straight to heaven, and that’s why you have a religion like that, and it is not the religion of the Bible, it is not the same deity, and anybody who teaches it, I believe is either sincerely deceived or deceptive. So I just want to, before we close off completely, Shabazz, will you just tell the viewers about your ministry that you are doing? Yes, our ministry, the ministry is Advent Lighthouse Ministries, and your viewers can check us out on our website, adventlighthouse.org, and our ministry is basically geared and tailored to reach Muslims, specifically Persian-speaking Muslims, there’s about 130 million Iranian Persian-speaking people in the world, and it’s not just that, but beyond that, but that’s our specific goal and point, and God raised this ministry and we are reaching people in an unprecedented way now.
We have 20 Bible workers that we support that live on the ground in that region, and they are planting churches, and this year we’re going to bring on another, probably about 25 more Bible workers that will add to our number, so we should have around by the end of 2026, we should have about 45 Bible workers that work for our ministry, and God has blessed, God is the one who’s making this happen, we’re just following His directions, the Lord has blessed me, we have good people here that support the ministry, that work at the ministry, and our website and our Instagram account is growing amongst the Persian-speaking people, diaspora outside of the region, in the 1040 window region, and within the 1040 window region, and people are hearing the gospel, they’re hearing the messages, in fact, the husband of one of our employees, who’s an Iranian, he’s translating Walter’s presentations into Persian, so Walter is now speaking in tongues in Persian, and it’s really fascinating to see those sermons in Persian, so God is blessing this ministry, our work is growing, and please pray for us, and we’ll continue to pray for you, God bless you. Thank you, it was an honor to speak to you. It was an absolute pleasure to speak to you, I know this will be considered controversial by many, but I believe it is a sincere longing to reach people that have been kept in basically darkness regarding all of these issues, and everybody has a right to hear the gospel and to be able to respond to it, and your mission is very, very important, and God will bless your mission, because it is the message for our time to those people that you are trying to reach.
May God richly bless what you are doing. Thank you, thank you so much, thank you for having me, God bless you. Thank you, shall we close in prayer? Our loving Heavenly Father, we look at the other son, and we look at the turmoil of history, and the blood that has been shed over the ages, and basically what we have is a war against the Son of God, and Lord, I pray that even this presentation will somehow be instrumental in reaching people so that they can make a decision for the times that we are living in.
I pray that you will bless the ministry of Shabbaz, and that you will bless the efforts that we put forth to bring the three angels’ messages to the world, and thank you, Lord, that we can have discussions like this, and may they do the work that we envisioned for it to do. It’s our prayer in Jesus’ name, amen.
